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Post by mareofnight on Mar 28, 2013 21:04:11 GMT
Hmm. Maybe everything is all related to everything else because that's how society stuff tends to work?
Semi-related thing that annoys me sometimes: the word "patriarchy". It used to drive me nuts when I read history/sociology books written from a feminist angle threw the word around a lot without addressing it directly, since I'd be thinking "yeah, I know, men were in charge, and you have a cool technical term for it".
And then I finally got a book that did explain it, and it turns out that, at least in reference to early modern Europe, there's a lot more meaning to it than just men in charge. It's... the whole social structure, the ideas about hierarchy that people had at the time, that the head of a group owns and is responsible for those below him. After grokking that, things like feudal superiors being the "father" of their vassals, servants being considered low-status family members, etc. made a lot more sense. It's a very different way of thinking than what happened after the Enlightenment really caught on in terms of gender roles and social status (1800s-ish, I think?) - even though everyone was still being ruled over by a man, that man wasn't your (metaphorical) dad.
But now I see people talking about patriarchy in the 1700s and thinking it meant just that men were in charge, and that annoys me. Like, they'll say that xyz was caused by patriarchy, and it makes sense if you know that patriarchy at that time included these other things too, but I can tell that they only know that patriarchy means rule by men, and they think xyz was caused just by having men in charge.
/historyproblems
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Post by Soff on Mar 29, 2013 6:39:22 GMT
Well, the thing about feminism is that it's hard to point what the term is used to mean many times. What we call "straw feminism" could be equated as some kind of hate group, I guess? And the way media represent and simplify certain things can make some people believe that that is actually feminism. I think that is addressed by the article, tough... And yeah, the thing about social rules is that they create limits that are necessary. People needs to have an image of what a "woman" and a "man" are (and therefore, what they should be), even if it's to defy it and we can't fully control how that images are created (though it can be manipulated, that's why the insistence on making actually strong female characters is given such an importance). Sure, it's not nice to be told by "society" that we cannot do something because we were born female. It sucks pretty hard actually, and that's why it is good to question them, but trying to abolish them just doesn't make much sense, to me, because eventually you just find yourself with a scale of values that reproduces upside down the previous one. If you view what "men" are supposed to do as what's "good" and try to apply the same set of rules to women, you'll just make women that just take over the "man" role, but the values remain the same. As far as I know, the feminism movement is very fragmented by this kind of things. So, women don't want to be baby making machines... then that makes stay-at-home moms something to bash? "Feminism" has replyed lots of different things to this, so it's hard to speak of "it", because "it" doesn't really exist as a single entity. So I guess that what I'm trying to say is that you shouldn't feel bad about people's conceptions about such a difficult to define thing. You can try to understand what they are talking about (what is it they are calling "feminism" and what's their problem with it? Maybe they are even fair, even if the naming is problematic!) if it's a person whose views you care about and try to point out the problem with the term if it's appropriate. And yeah, general ignorance of certain things can be a little distressing because they seem such important matters... but we also ignore other very important matters. What makes humanity fun is that we do not all care for the same things. I suppose that there's some consolation in thinking that what drives change isn't the "will" of the masses, but the drive of individuals or small groups that manage to inconspicuosly (or not so much, but well...) plant their ideas so they'll be reproduced in such a way that that thing they fight for gets a better treatment after a while... or I think it's kinda like that, anyway. I mean, feminism was never such a huge majority, but I think we could be doing worse? And there will always be people who feel threatened by those that defy their categories (such as "men" and "women" and all the relations that they imply) and react violently to that, and it sucks, but letting that make you feel bad won't help matters. I hope that I made some sense! It's kinda late and my English is weird, but I wanted to add my 2 cents about this. And tell you that you should be happy despite people and mess because that's what I do !
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Post by clemon on Mar 29, 2013 17:51:58 GMT
Hmmm...Seems words in society get meshed and confused until people make their own definitions and use them in such way. It's really confusing. I actually don't use "Patriarchy", because I wasn't 100% sure what it meant. So in a sense I agree with people hating on people who hate men; misandry and misogyny are not cool. I just wish they'd not lump everyone in a group as having traits which actually go against the main idea.
I think feminism encourages women (and men) to be whatever they want to be; so if you want to be a stay-at-home mom or a stay-at-home dad, that's cool. As long as it's want you want and you're happy to be it. Feminism (like other groups) has a lot of individual differences based on people's personalities, so lumping feminists all together is kind of odd. I think in many ways the feminism that Soff is describing has worked (at the end, with the individuals bit): most people (in North America at least...?) want to treat the different genders equally.
Girls in video games can be a...challenging topic to talk about (especially for me--who doesn't play video games). I think it mainly comes down to people not wanting their favourite games to be changed, while other people point out sexist things within the games. I'm more for introducing new games with balanced gender and character distribution, because I wouldn't want to take away people's favourite games when the whole "Do games influence players?" is kind of murky with mixed results. I think there's also somewhat of a hostility against female players, but I admit, I don't know too much about that.
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Post by X'o'Lore on Apr 13, 2013 22:55:40 GMT
Well, I installed a new router at home. Somehow it messed with the modem and angered the Internet God (a.k.a. my ISP) and now demands a username and password to access my internet at home. This information was used once...over 10 years ago when the internet was first installed. So I don't have that and the ISP company is shut down until Monday.
Now I got many hours of internet-based homework to do from someone else's computer at a not-home kind of place.
Moral of this story: these new routers suck and mess up your internets, so do these things during business hours instead of on a Friday night.
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Post by clemon on Apr 14, 2013 3:22:03 GMT
Could the moral of the story be to store your username & password is secret code on paper next to your computer so you never forget it? ; )
Related: I also don't know the username + password of my internet connection. But most of my homework can be done from any location.
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Post by X'o'Lore on Apr 15, 2013 16:57:21 GMT
Considering the username and password were both obscure random numbers set by the ISP and entered by one of their techs when they installed the internet all those years ago it's probably unreasonable to think anyone here would remember it after more than a decade.
It's sorted now. Internet at home yay. I'm such an addict.
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Post by Ally on Apr 15, 2013 20:57:21 GMT
Hmmm...Seems words in society get meshed and confused until people make their own definitions and use them in such way. It's really confusing. I actually don't use "Patriarchy", because I wasn't 100% sure what it meant. So in a sense I agree with people hating on people who hate men; misandry and misogyny are not cool. I just wish they'd not lump everyone in a group as having traits which actually go against the main idea. I learned a term not so long ago which I really like: kyriarchy - which relates to all the interconnected systems of oppression and domination (i.e. race, physical ability etc, as well as gender). It makes a lot of sense to me, because, for example, not all men have equal advantages in patriarchy (i.e., a white, straight, able-bodied man is going to have a lot more social advantages than a black, gay, disabled man). I think feminism encourages women (and men) to be whatever they want to be; so if you want to be a stay-at-home mom or a stay-at-home dad, that's cool. As long as it's want you want and you're happy to be it. I agree As long as people have a full range of choice that isn't predicated by inequality (i.e., a stay-at-home mum is doing it because she really wants to, and not because she earns less than a man for doing the same job and so her income is the one that she and her husband can afford to lose), then whatever you choose, it's all good.
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Post by X'o'Lore on May 5, 2013 2:19:54 GMT
I'm supposed to be writing a big midterm paper for a class that barely relates to my major, and now the furnace isn't working and it's like 40 degrees outside. Or 5 degrees if you like Celsius. It's pretty cold sitting at my computer trying to type. Also my mother is in the hospital with some weird virus that's apparently giving her super severe vertigo and she apparently may never fully recover her sense of balance If I understand it correctly.
I've had better days.
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Fuin
Bucaneer
Posts: 48
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Post by Fuin on May 8, 2013 19:07:27 GMT
Going to City Hall today to deal with people who may not want me to open my shop for an hour. Not looking forward to it... have to go alone because all my friends are busy.
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Post by Tea on May 8, 2013 19:35:41 GMT
Uh oh, I hope it goes your way Fuin.
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Post by clemon on May 12, 2013 20:17:26 GMT
Fuin: Pretend they're standing around in their underwear? And if you're trying to persuade them to change their minds again (because I assume this already happened by now), try appeals to empathy or reiterating some of their arguments against yours with evidence to counter them. I'm not 100% sure if that'll work, but I hope it went ok. @x: I hear things are less stressful if you take it as a challenge, and use opportunities like these to show the world how you are a well-rounded scholar. Freezing temperatures? Don't drink water, and wear a coat. As for your mum, I hope she feels better.
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Post by X'o'Lore on May 12, 2013 20:52:15 GMT
Well the furnace has since been fixed, my mom is back home and only a bit out of sorts, but I did not manage to complete all my homework. I got the paper done at least and did perfectly fine on it.
Also it sounded like things went reasonably well with Fuin judging by the lovey thread.
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Post by mareofnight on May 12, 2013 21:55:16 GMT
I'm really tired lately. It's annoying.
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Zamisk
Pirate
Scourge o' the Cosmos
Posts: 86
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Post by Zamisk on May 14, 2013 16:02:26 GMT
She's moving away
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Post by clemon on May 19, 2013 21:27:36 GMT
That's a pretty vague statement to make. And quite open to much interpretation. I shall speculate that because this is the "hatey hatey" thread, you must hate that she's going; thus, she must be pretty important to you to remain "not away". I don't know that nature of your guys' relationship, but that's pretty much all I can figure out. ; )
@ mareofnight: Do you have a consistent sleep cycle? My sister--continual caring criticizer of my life--makes me keep a relatively consistent sleeping cycle because otherwise I'm apparently always tired.
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Zamisk
Pirate
Scourge o' the Cosmos
Posts: 86
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Post by Zamisk on May 21, 2013 1:49:29 GMT
There is this girl I went on a few dates with who went away on an exchange program to Spain for the past few months. She just got back and told me her family's moving. I'm 17, I'll get over it.
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Post by mareofnight on May 21, 2013 3:07:04 GMT
Zamisk: That's still really non-fun though clemon: Sort of? Though in that case, the reason was pretty obvious, I'd had only 6 hours of sleep a couple nights ago (8 is basically my minimum) and hadn't slept extra to make up for it yet. And now I've recovered after finally actually sleeping in. Only problem is I'm supposed to be becoming a morning person about now because I have an internship with full-time hours coming up (and would like to be waking up at least 2 hours before work, to avoid rushing and give me some time to talk to my other-side-of-the-world friends), and staying up in the evening to hang out with my mom kinda defeats that. But I'm living away from home when the job starts, so hopefully I'll be able to sleep better there. I'm kinda having love interest problems again. First I have to leave the town they live in, then they're not even in the same country, then they move to a foreign country and after figuring out a way to come see them I find out they might not be there by the time I get there (This, uh, isn't all the same person. I'm kinda bad about falling for people who don't live near me.) They're trying to stay put, but... arg. If you end up back in the US while I'm where you used to be, you'd better at least stay put in this country long enough for me to catch up with you. I probably need to just try not to think about this for now, since there's probably no way to know what's going to happen anytime soon. EDIT: Talked to person again, things are more likely to work out than I'd thought. So that's good. Just gonna keep trying not to think about the other possibility.
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Post by Tea on May 23, 2013 18:02:12 GMT
Where to start? I have a whole mess of problems but they're sort of connected.
Last night I had an argument with my step-mum, on the surface it was about absolutely nothing but really it was about me still living here and having overstayed my welcome.
This leads into the problem that I can't move out until I get a job but I am completely failing at getting a job. I'm trying but I'm over or under qualified for everything I apply for. Or something like that.
And this sort of ties into the problem of my best friend moving to Germany. Normally if I have an argument with my step-mum or feel depressed because I can't find a job I meet up with my friend and we do fun things. Now she's in another country and I don't have a lot of real life friends who live nearby and the ones that do have full time jobs and can't hang out with me at a moment's notice to cheer me up.
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Post by Soff on May 24, 2013 4:34:39 GMT
Aaw, that sucks, Tea! The job thing is always quite a crappy thing, but you'll eventually find something. It's really sad that things are so tense with your family and that finding the job becomes harder when you're so pressed, but if you're well qualified and eventually something will turn out. Starting out is always very difficult, because you're really doing something new that you were not taught for: finding your own way. So it's hard for you to see how things will turn out right now when everything is so... hostile to you. But try not to beat yourself over having a hard time! Feeling bad about things being difficult is normal. Try not to listen too much to what your stepmum says. Family has this awful thing where they sometimes make things way harder than they should, instead of helping, even when they think they are giving you "a push in the right direction" or something like that. You can only... try to avoid conflict in that kind of situation, I think... Ehrm... I'm not being helpful, sorry. But, really, you'll find a way out of all this. You're in a critical moment of your life, it's normal for things to be difficult. Once this is through, you'll get into the fun things of being an adult, like... paying taxes? Like being able to be on your own without your family annoying you, I guess ;P .
And about your friend, can't you close yourself into your room and call your friend? To feel closer to her? Or go for a walk? I have a friend that does that when things get too conflictive. Do some exercise of some kind of physical thing, to just disconnect your brain and quit making yourself even angrier. And, well, you can always come here and angrily write at the whole situation. We're always here to read you!
Yay, Mare, I'm glad that's sorted out! I hope it does work out!
I'm sorry about that, Zam. If you're down, let yourself be down. Being 17 doesn't mean that things that happen to you are not important. The fact that you'd have probably not... married this girl doesn't mean that it isn't important now. Though, yeah, you'll probably get over it! It may take a while, though. Just, don't feel bad about feeling bad... I know I sound like a parrot reapeating that, but it's something I feel is important.
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Post by X'o'Lore on May 26, 2013 8:29:44 GMT
Well I've managed to sidestep having friends to talk to moving away. Though I'm not sure I HAVE friends to talk to on that level so that may be it. But yeah. I hear you on the job thing. I hate job hunting.
Other than that, have you ever talked to someone who seemed to actually be knowledgeable about things that you are fairly passionate about but then they start partly bragging about things that are actually kinda childish and silly if you were actually knowledgeable about it and also say things that you know are straight up incorrect and you realize they don't know near as much as they think they do. Then they start spreading incorrect information to everyone else and you can't correct them because everyone will think you are wrong? Don't be that guy. That guy guy leaves me quite annoyed. (For the record, AMD never bought Cyrix, Windows RT does NOT run on Atom processors, and bragging about World or Warcraft running at 300-400 FPS on your quad graphics card computer just tells me you have a lot more money than sense.)
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