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Post by stuart alman on Dec 6, 2005 15:32:54 GMT
While looking up some stuff on evolution i came across this website which shows some statements made by creationists and then the arguement which proves these statements to be completely bullshit. Its quite funny yet very informative. www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/list.html
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Post by stokerino on Dec 6, 2005 15:39:46 GMT
It's always nice to see people taking the care to lay out arguments with sources and everything.
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Post by Ally on Dec 6, 2005 15:44:28 GMT
I'll read through all that when I've got time...the whole debate does interest me, and although I don't believe in creationism, it's good that some people are actually trying to make a proper argument rather than going on the whole blind faith approach.
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Post by Emily on Dec 6, 2005 18:05:36 GMT
see now I was taking all seriously until i found;
Last Thursdayism, the unfalsifiable view that the universe and everything in it was created last Thursday with only the appearance of earlier history
It was in an example of what they'd have to teach in schools if they gave equal time to creationism and evolutionism in science... but I think it's getting a bit silly. I don't think people should make jokes in debates as it undermines them.
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Post by Emily on Dec 6, 2005 18:24:39 GMT
I've also been reading the creationists articles for another side to the story.
"At the Institute for Creation Research, our highly qualified and experienced scientists study the scientific data regarding origins, and claim their research shows that the evidence from the universe fits perfectly with what the Word of God says, and not well at all with the evolutionary theories of men!"
where is this evidence, why isn't it in your article? How am i supposed to take you seriously when you can't form a sensible debate and just quote the bible?
"If there was a big bang what caused it?"
Who knows? Maybe it was god... maybe god is an evolutionist. Evolution does not disprove the existence of god, it just says that things didn't start the way we thought they did.
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Post by stokerino on Dec 6, 2005 18:44:22 GMT
I also like the way they feel the need to describe their scientists as "highly qualified and experienced"...it's like they know what people are going to point out, and are trying to prevent them from even asking those awkward questions in the first place.
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Post by Emily on Dec 6, 2005 23:49:25 GMT
"We are evolutionists, here is our evidence..."
"we are the creationists, and yeah we've got evidence but we don't need to tell you what it is or where we got it, because our book says you're all going to hell..."
(and according to tom, who because of his upbringing has had copious amounts of bible lore and theology inserted into his brain, the bible translated from its original form makes no mention of heaven, hell or in fact satan as actual things. Heaven is to be in the presence of god, hell is the absence of god or to be dead, and the devil is your own temptation to do evil, not an entity. All these things are in fact inventions of catholicism, to usurp pagan religions and to keep the populace in fear.)
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Post by Mindy on Dec 7, 2005 0:43:51 GMT
There's a really good book which I got from an Islamic Studies student when we were doing our group presentation about the need for religion (I was doing it from the science perspective if you couldn't guess). It was really interesting & helpful, but it was let down by a line which said that homosexuality was unnatural...
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Post by Ally on Dec 7, 2005 2:15:04 GMT
I like Blake's idea (because I love him ;D) - good and evil are both necessary parts of life. Let's face it, if we were all pleasant all the time, the world would be a very creepy and boring place.
What really annoyed me (I still haven't read it yet, I was out this evening) was that one title on how science is trying to destroy religion. Sure, because there aren't any religious scientists around... Science is just trying to explain the world, pretty much like religion used to, but from a more informed position.
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Post by stuart alman on Dec 7, 2005 13:41:56 GMT
didnt that good and evil thing come up in Satans song in south park the movie.....
And the we have a theory on what caused the big bang these days its called "M theory" and basically states that the universe is made up of millions of membranous parrallel universes which when they collide cause a big bang,.
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Post by Ally on Dec 7, 2005 14:11:05 GMT
didnt that good and evil thing come up in Satans song in south park the movie..... Yes, it did. But I have this vague suspicion that Blake thought of it before Trey Parker and Matt Stone did.
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Post by rincewind on Dec 7, 2005 14:16:52 GMT
well i am a ferm believer in Darwinian Evolution and this whole bloody argument is due to stu sitting next to me while i did an essay on whether Intelligent desing should be taught in schools!! just think how i feel!! hahaha
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Post by Emily on Dec 8, 2005 11:53:18 GMT
but do you believe that darwinian theory negates religion, or that the two can co exist?
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Post by Ally on Dec 8, 2005 13:40:38 GMT
I think God and Darwinism can co-exist (in my mind, God and religion are totally separate, but that's a whole other debate...) - hell, if God's omniscient and omnipotent, then he/she/it's smart enough to come up with something like evolution.
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Post by stuart alman on Dec 8, 2005 17:38:43 GMT
well evolution could tie in with the whole concept of free will in a weird sort of way..
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Post by Lu on Dec 8, 2005 19:17:52 GMT
maybe they should just agree to disagree. neither can prove absolutely that they're right due to not being around at the world beginning and existence up to this point
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Post by rincewind on Dec 8, 2005 20:35:12 GMT
there will probably a war over it in the near future!!!! mark my words!!
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Post by stokerino on Dec 8, 2005 20:50:25 GMT
Or...not.
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Post by Mindy on Dec 8, 2005 23:38:06 GMT
maybe they should just agree to disagree. neither can prove absolutely that they're right due to not being around at the world beginning and existence up to this point And that was my conclusion in my part of the group presentation i did
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Post by petrobrad on Dec 9, 2005 18:56:57 GMT
I believe in balance, free will and evolution. Balance suggests more than one force, leading to conflict which forces beings to evolve to survive. Free will is something all beings have and no one should force someone to do or believe something against their will, including the god('s) as in comparison to the universe we are all basically the same.
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